Comments on: You can keep ‘em. http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/ In-your-face baseball commentary Sun, 21 Mar 2010 21:48:19 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Paul Moro http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52537 Paul Moro Mon, 14 May 2007 13:48:24 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52537 Let's see, Red Sox players who went on to become successful Yankees: Babe Ruth Roger Clemens Wade Boggs Johnny Damon Sparky Lyle Tom Gordon Yankees players who went on to become successful Red Sox: Mike Stanley That is all. And Stanley wasn't even that good. The list of washed up Yankees who played for the Red Sox: Rickey Henderson David Cone David Wells Elston Howard Don Baylor Rick Cerrone etc. That list is much much longer. Let’s see, Red Sox players who went on to become successful Yankees:

Babe Ruth

Roger Clemens

Wade Boggs

Johnny Damon

Sparky Lyle

Tom Gordon

Yankees players who went on to become successful Red Sox:

Mike Stanley

That is all.

And Stanley wasn’t even that good. The list of washed up Yankees who played for the Red Sox:

Rickey Henderson

David Cone

David Wells

Elston Howard

Don Baylor

Rick Cerrone

etc.

That list is much much longer.

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]]> By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52536 Sarah Green Mon, 14 May 2007 00:32:39 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52536 I was never a fan of David Wells. He always complained about playing in Boston because fans kept wanting to buy him drinks and come up and say hi on the street. Cry me a freakin' river, Fatty McBadknees. Ramiro Mendoza was sort of a nonissue for me. He was like the color beige. Didn't love him, didn't hate him. He was just...there. The Bernie thing was weird. I didn't enjoy having my feelings toyed with. He was clearly just trying to make the Yankees jealous, and it worked. David Cone I did enjoy having on the team. I was at that game when he and Mike Mussina both pitched so well, and Moose took a perfect game into the 9th. And, despite what some may say about irrational Sox fans, I was rooting for the perfect game in that situation. Here's a trivia question for you. Have the Red Sox ever actually signed a face of the Yankee franchise? I mean by my count, the Yanks have now nabbed Ruth, Clemens (via Toronto, but whatevs), and Damon. But Cone, Mendoza, and Wells were way past their primes and had been around the MLB block (hardly Franchise Face material). I was never a fan of David Wells. He always complained about playing in Boston because fans kept wanting to buy him drinks and come up and say hi on the street. Cry me a freakin’ river, Fatty McBadknees.

Ramiro Mendoza was sort of a nonissue for me. He was like the color beige. Didn’t love him, didn’t hate him. He was just…there. The Bernie thing was weird. I didn’t enjoy having my feelings toyed with. He was clearly just trying to make the Yankees jealous, and it worked.

David Cone I did enjoy having on the team. I was at that game when he and Mike Mussina both pitched so well, and Moose took a perfect game into the 9th. And, despite what some may say about irrational Sox fans, I was rooting for the perfect game in that situation.

Here’s a trivia question for you. Have the Red Sox ever actually signed a face of the Yankee franchise? I mean by my count, the Yanks have now nabbed Ruth, Clemens (via Toronto, but whatevs), and Damon. But Cone, Mendoza, and Wells were way past their primes and had been around the MLB block (hardly Franchise Face material).

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]]> By: Brian Sadecki http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52535 Brian Sadecki Fri, 11 May 2007 04:25:09 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52535 Paul Moro said: "And A-Rod nowadays would make a terrible defensive shortstop. He ain’t going back." It's why I said all that stuff. I'm not just some sycophantic A-Rod lover. Why are ARod's April stats meaningless but Alex Gonzalez's Hurculean summer is something to be preserved in epic poetry? The fans coming around on A-Rod really isn't that hard to figure out. He's putting numbers on the board in really dramatic fashion. But he is a total boogerface. Were you not a fan of: David Wells Ramiro Mendoza David Cone Would you have thumbed your nose had the deal gone through in 98 to get Bernie? This is exactly what I'm talking about. Sox fans are bigger fans of the rivalry than they are of their own team or the game itself. Paul Moro said:

“And A-Rod nowadays would make a terrible defensive shortstop. He ain’t going back.”

It’s why I said all that stuff. I’m not just some sycophantic A-Rod lover.

Why are ARod’s April stats meaningless but Alex Gonzalez’s Hurculean summer is something to be preserved in epic poetry?

The fans coming around on A-Rod really isn’t that hard to figure out. He’s putting numbers on the board in really dramatic fashion. But he is a total boogerface.

Were you not a fan of:

David Wells

Ramiro Mendoza

David Cone

Would you have thumbed your nose had the deal gone through in 98 to get Bernie?

This is exactly what I’m talking about. Sox fans are bigger fans of the rivalry than they are of their own team or the game itself.

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]]> By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52534 Sarah Green Fri, 11 May 2007 03:27:51 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52534 Brian, no one said A-Rod would be *terrible* defensively at short. But I don't buy the argument that his defense at that posish would really be a selling point anymore. The basic idea is that I just really, really, really do not ever want to see A-Rod standing at third or short or even first base for the Red Sox, ever. Ever. He is a Yankee. Let him stay there. The Yankees may steal our players, but let us rise above this and not do it back. They can keep their plastic A-Rod action figure and his meaningless April stats. I don't know when Yankee fans decided to make A-Rod their new sacred cow, but it was sure a lot more fun when everyone was just booing him all the time. Yeesh. Brian, no one said A-Rod would be *terrible* defensively at short. But I don’t buy the argument that his defense at that posish would really be a selling point anymore.

The basic idea is that I just really, really, really do not ever want to see A-Rod standing at third or short or even first base for the Red Sox, ever. Ever. He is a Yankee. Let him stay there. The Yankees may steal our players, but let us rise above this and not do it back. They can keep their plastic A-Rod action figure and his meaningless April stats. I don’t know when Yankee fans decided to make A-Rod their new sacred cow, but it was sure a lot more fun when everyone was just booing him all the time. Yeesh.

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]]> By: Brian Sadecki http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52533 Brian Sadecki Thu, 10 May 2007 16:54:54 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52533 Paul, I don't necessarily disagree although I wouldn't write him off because of one flubbed defensive season. He lost something like 15 pounds over the spring. Although that doesn't look right as I type it... Point is, he lost a lot of weight. I'm not saying he would still be the amazing short stop he once was. But if the only reasons to do so are his age (stupid) and one bad defensive year (stupid) then I think that's, you know, stupid. This was all in response to "ARod would make a terrible defensive shortstop" which, now that we've all had a chance to think about, we know is not true. AT, that motto seems really long and cumbersome. You should really consider changing it to something concise. "F*ck the Yankees!" might be a little on-the-nose but it's on the right track. Also, do these parades interfere with the team's October golf schedule? Paul, I don’t necessarily disagree although I wouldn’t write him off because of one flubbed defensive season. He lost something like 15 pounds over the spring. Although that doesn’t look right as I type it… Point is, he lost a lot of weight.

I’m not saying he would still be the amazing short stop he once was. But if the only reasons to do so are his age (stupid) and one bad defensive year (stupid) then I think that’s, you know, stupid.

This was all in response to “ARod would make a terrible defensive shortstop” which, now that we’ve all had a chance to think about, we know is not true.

AT, that motto seems really long and cumbersome. You should really consider changing it to something concise. “F*ck the Yankees!” might be a little on-the-nose but it’s on the right track.

Also, do these parades interfere with the team’s October golf schedule?

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]]> By: AT http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52532 AT Thu, 10 May 2007 15:44:16 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52532 A Sox fan's motto is "If you dick us over, you're dead to us and we'll let you know it loud and proud. If you dick over the Yankees, we'll throw you a parade." Well, that and "F*ck the Yankees!" A Sox fan’s motto is “If you dick us over, you’re dead to us and we’ll let you know it loud and proud. If you dick over the Yankees, we’ll throw you a parade.” Well, that and “F*ck the Yankees!”

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]]> By: Paul Moro http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52531 Paul Moro Thu, 10 May 2007 13:51:38 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52531 I think we need to stop thinking about A-Rod as "playing out of position". He's been at third for over three years. He's a third baseman now. I think we've gotten to the point where putting him at short would be "playing him out of position". Out of the regular third basemen last year (i.e. playing over 900 innings at the position), A-Rod had the worst fielding pct at .937. That's just bad. To his credit, he did post a very respectable .971 in 2005, but his Zone Rating has been declining since 2004 (though I can't find his 2007 ZR yet). His range was great in '04 and '05, leading ML 3B in balls he fielded out of his zone. In 2006, he was just average in doing so (again, 2007 numbers unavailable). I just think he is no longer capable to playing the position. And even though he is only turning 32 this year, speed and agility is the first thing to go in athletes. One thing I can't take into account is his weight since I haven't been keeping track. Maybe he put on some more muscle since he no longer has to cover much ground as a guy who plays the hot corner. I don't know. But I do know that his defensive statistics are on a downward trend. He used to be a very good at third. Now, he's average at best. To me, that would make him an inadequate shortstop. And yes, I've heard every argument there is to hear regarding the subjectiveness of defensive statistics. But I also can't delude myself into thinking that I have a knack as a baseball scout and can merely tell by looking. People like me have to rely on stats because my perceptions are often wrong. So these stats are the best I can do. I think we need to stop thinking about A-Rod as “playing out of position”. He’s been at third for over three years. He’s a third baseman now. I think we’ve gotten to the point where putting him at short would be “playing him out of position”.

Out of the regular third basemen last year (i.e. playing over 900 innings at the position), A-Rod had the worst fielding pct at .937. That’s just bad. To his credit, he did post a very respectable .971 in 2005, but his Zone Rating has been declining since 2004 (though I can’t find his 2007 ZR yet). His range was great in ‘04 and ‘05, leading ML 3B in balls he fielded out of his zone. In 2006, he was just average in doing so (again, 2007 numbers unavailable). I just think he is no longer capable to playing the position. And even though he is only turning 32 this year, speed and agility is the first thing to go in athletes. One thing I can’t take into account is his weight since I haven’t been keeping track. Maybe he put on some more muscle since he no longer has to cover much ground as a guy who plays the hot corner. I don’t know. But I do know that his defensive statistics are on a downward trend. He used to be a very good at third. Now, he’s average at best. To me, that would make him an inadequate shortstop.

And yes, I’ve heard every argument there is to hear regarding the subjectiveness of defensive statistics. But I also can’t delude myself into thinking that I have a knack as a baseball scout and can merely tell by looking. People like me have to rely on stats because my perceptions are often wrong. So these stats are the best I can do.

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]]> By: Brian Sadecki http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52530 Brian Sadecki Thu, 10 May 2007 07:14:19 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52530 It's a little unfair to assume ARod would make a shitty SS now. He's 31 which, as we all know, is the new 30. He's playing out of his position now and has to make up for Jeter's crap range. If Jeter wasn't so proud or in Torre's magical trust circle, they'd switch. So, what I'm saying is: sign ARod to Boston at SS. It’s a little unfair to assume ARod would make a shitty SS now. He’s 31 which, as we all know, is the new 30. He’s playing out of his position now and has to make up for Jeter’s crap range.

If Jeter wasn’t so proud or in Torre’s magical trust circle, they’d switch.

So, what I’m saying is: sign ARod to Boston at SS.

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]]> By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52543 Sarah Green Wed, 09 May 2007 22:34:39 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52543 A-Rod was great at SS in the day, but there's no turning back the clock now. Otherwise, I'd nix J.D. Drew and sign Dwight Evans, circa 1987. A-Rod was great at SS in the day, but there’s no turning back the clock now. Otherwise, I’d nix J.D. Drew and sign Dwight Evans, circa 1987.

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]]> By: Brian Sadecki http://umpbump.com/press/2007/05/08/you-can-keep-em/comment-page-1/#comment-52541 Brian Sadecki Wed, 09 May 2007 14:33:05 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/you-can-keep-em/#comment-52541 And in 3 months out of 6 he was hitting under .200 His bat didn't come alive, he was just chasing his mean just like he will this season. Also, guess who was better defensively at SS. And in 3 months out of 6 he was hitting under .200

His bat didn’t come alive, he was just chasing his mean just like he will this season.

Also, guess who was better defensively at SS.

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