Comments on: Chien-Ming Wang is no Cy Young

By: Sarah Green

Sarah Green — Sat, 15 Sep 2007 04:02:02 +0000

http://www.firejoemorgan.com/2007/09/this-is-what-happens-when-rick.html

Their take on Sabathia vs. Wang vs. Beckett vs……Halladay?

By: Sagliba

Sagliba — Sat, 15 Sep 2007 01:27:31 +0000

Don’t sweep Wang’s success as simply run support from his teammates. Wang gave Yankees many wins before their bats got hot. He does not have many SO’s, but that’s the style of his pitching. OTOH, He only surrendered 8 Homers, way less than other Cy Young candidates.

If he got 20 wins, it’s tough not to consider him!

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By: Doogan

Doogan — Fri, 14 Sep 2007 21:27:59 +0000

Daniel, so a .72 differential in ERA over a whole season doesn’t mean anything to you? Kyle Lohse has only given up 13 more runs than Wang all year in about the same amount of innings. Should we throw him into to the Cy Young conversation, too? You could play that ‘only this many more runs’ game with everybody. Bottom line is Beckett’s had a better year. I think Wang is just as good and effective pitcher overall though, and I would certainly take either one on my team. Even over Kyle Lohse!

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By: Sarah Green

Sarah Green — Fri, 14 Sep 2007 13:53:17 +0000

Yes, I don’t think anyone is saying that Wang isn’t a good pitcher. He’s clearly an excellent pitcher and a central part of the Yankee staff! But the Cy Young, I think, is about more than being a central part of the staff. The pitchers I feel bad for are actually guys like Scott Kazmir, who is so, so good but doesn’t have the record he should have because of the team he plays for. Poor Kazmir. One day, his ship will come in.

Here’s a question for you: if you were a GM, would you rather have Beckett or Wang on your team for next year?

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By: Daniel

Daniel — Fri, 14 Sep 2007 09:19:04 +0000

Doogan says, “a 3.27 ERA is a good better than a 3.69.” well, it seems that way. but in fact wang only gave up 8 more runs than beckett did all year. is that really so much worse than beckett? I don’t think so, especially if you take away the worst game of wang’s career (where he gave up 8 runs in less than 3 innings).

nevertheless, i have to admit that beckett deserves it slightly more than wang.

next year, however, i think wang’s era will be somewhat lower (

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By: Cy L

Cy L — Fri, 14 Sep 2007 03:47:36 +0000

I agreed with Paul Moro\’s analysis on Wang wholeheartedly. Statistically, no one can figure him out. His pitching stas just couldn\’t be explained with all that formulas. His bowling-ball like sinker has kept him in the lead in MLB wins for 2 years. In 2006, people were saying he was just a fluke. This year with 18 wins and going strong, many still have skeptism. I don\’t think he deserves Cy Young this year, but he does deserve some consideration and respect. With that said, I believe C.C. is the sure thing for Cy Young, or at least he deserves more than Beckett.

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By: Doogan

Doogan — Thu, 13 Sep 2007 21:16:47 +0000

Yeah, I mean, Beckett and Wang have had comparable seasons, but when it comes down it, a 3.27 ERA is a good bit better than a 3.69. You can talk about wins and strike outs all you want, but the amount of earned runs a pitcher gives up is really what it’s all about, right?

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By: Sarah Green

Sarah Green — Thu, 13 Sep 2007 15:05:09 +0000

The point is, you don’t get EXTRA POINTS for the Cy Young for being the ONLY GUY on the team who can be counted on to give a quality start.

Let’s look at some differences between Beckett and Wang, aside from strikeouts (for the record, Beckett has 173 and Wang has 91). After all, Wang and Beckett do have the same records (18-6 in 27 starts) and have thrown almost the exact same number of innings (Wang is at 180.2, Beckett at 181.2) and each has one complete game.

Yet in addition to more macho, macho strikeouts, Beckett has a marginally lower WHIP (1.14 to Wang’s 1.27) and slightly lower ERA (3.27 to Wang’s 3.69). Beckett also has just 36 walks to Wang’s 52. The only standard stat that tips Wang’s way is that Beckett has allowed 14 home runs this year, while Wang has allowed only 8. As discussed above, this is because Wang is a groundball pitcher. Wang is also ranked second in run support in the league, while Beckett is sixth. (For the record, Mr. Sabathia is 12th.)

Thus, if the Cy Young comes down to Beckett versus Wang today (and, as noted above, today it should go to CC Sabathia), Beckett gets it for being marginally better than Wang by being the more dominant pitcher by nearly every statistical measure.

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By: Pete

Pete — Thu, 13 Sep 2007 14:32:58 +0000

(9) – well then taking away the K’s, how is Beckett that much better than Wang?

And as for this writer who’s claiming the Yankees would be ‘toast’ without Wang, well he’s actually half right. Throw Pettitte into that statement and they really would be done for the year by now.

But still, any guy who racks up nearly 1/4 of a team’s wins is pretty indispensable. I don’t think you can assume the Yankees make up those games without him, especially considering the prolonged offensive slump in the first few months.

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By: Rich

Rich — Thu, 13 Sep 2007 13:23:41 +0000

Normally I would wonder if Wang might suffer from the “Derek-Lowe Effect”.

That is, as a ground-ball pitcher playing for the Yankees, his defense is very good. Put him on team with significant holes behind him, and his ERA rises as more outs become hits, and then runs.

However, he posted a 1.75 ERA during his time with the Staten Island Yankees (Single A). While I believe it’s expected that quality pitchers should dominate at the low minor level, a 1.75 ERA seems to belie the “DLowe Effect”.

He’ll be interesting to watch.

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