Comments on: Cookies for Rookies http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/ In-your-face baseball commentary Sat, 21 Nov 2009 16:48:13 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53222 Sarah Green Thu, 04 Oct 2007 18:20:02 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53222 Come now, Nick. There's room for both approaches! I like observation and gut feelings and not reducing everything to numbers, but when something is as obvious as being last in many statistical categories (as in the case of Jeter's defense), one has to sit up and take notice. Reyes is good, to be sure. He's just not the hands-down best, defensively. And he sure ain't the best offensively. Come now, Nick. There’s room for both approaches! I like observation and gut feelings and not reducing everything to numbers, but when something is as obvious as being last in many statistical categories (as in the case of Jeter’s defense), one has to sit up and take notice. Reyes is good, to be sure. He’s just not the hands-down best, defensively. And he sure ain’t the best offensively.

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]]> By: Nick Kapur http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53221 Nick Kapur Thu, 04 Oct 2007 03:40:31 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53221 Whoa! Look at you go, Sarah, you've become a stathead! Throwing range factor and zone rating in Coley's face when he talks of what he's actually seen with his own eyes! What happened to that old traditionalist Sarah, who didn't like Murray Chass's approach but felt she could at least understand his point of view that stats might be "undermining enjoyment of the game"? Whoa! Look at you go, Sarah, you’ve become a stathead! Throwing range factor and zone rating in Coley’s face when he talks of what he’s actually seen with his own eyes!

What happened to that old traditionalist Sarah, who didn’t like Murray Chass’s approach but felt she could at least understand his point of view that stats might be “undermining enjoyment of the game”?

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]]> By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53229 Sarah Green Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:19:13 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53229 Reyes' fielding percentage puts him right in the middle of the pack of NL shortstops (which we admitted above is a deep field right now). He's actually second-to-last in range factor, though he ranks third in zone rating (just behind T-Bone). Overall, the numbers don't portray him as a great glove. Jeter is similar---middling to bottom-of-the pack according to most defensive metrics. Yet Jeter won a Gold Glove last year. There's no accounting for hype. Reyes’ fielding percentage puts him right in the middle of the pack of NL shortstops (which we admitted above is a deep field right now). He’s actually second-to-last in range factor, though he ranks third in zone rating (just behind T-Bone). Overall, the numbers don’t portray him as a great glove. Jeter is similar—middling to bottom-of-the pack according to most defensive metrics. Yet Jeter won a Gold Glove last year. There’s no accounting for hype.

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]]> By: Coley Ward http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53224 Coley Ward Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:34:13 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53224 Sarah, to be fair, I haven't watched Tulowitzki much this season. But I've seen enough of Reyes to know that -- his late season struggles aside -- he is one of the best defensive short stops I've ever watched. I'm curious, was Tulowitski's range factor better than Reyes'? What makes you think Reyes is overrated? Sarah, to be fair, I haven’t watched Tulowitzki much this season. But I’ve seen enough of Reyes to know that — his late season struggles aside — he is one of the best defensive short stops I’ve ever watched. I’m curious, was Tulowitski’s range factor better than Reyes’? What makes you think Reyes is overrated?

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]]> By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53228 Sarah Green Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:16:06 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53228 Pete, your sarcasm is duly noted. But who would you have picked? gej, Renteria has certainly performed for the Braves (in a way that he never performed for the Red Sox, grumble grumble). Reyes is okay but he's not better than Tulowitzki either offensively or defensively, at least not this season. Reyes gets extra attention from the national media because he plays in New York, which is where most of the national media are located. Pete, your sarcasm is duly noted. But who would you have picked?

gej, Renteria has certainly performed for the Braves (in a way that he never performed for the Red Sox, grumble grumble). Reyes is okay but he’s not better than Tulowitzki either offensively or defensively, at least not this season. Reyes gets extra attention from the national media because he plays in New York, which is where most of the national media are located.

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]]> By: Pete http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53227 Pete Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:01:17 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53227 Pedroia? On this site? Shocker!!! Pedroia? On this site?

Shocker!!!

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]]> By: gej http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53226 gej Wed, 03 Oct 2007 14:33:22 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53226 If you're going to take Renteria, then there's four. One has to think that Jose Reyes is also better, correct? If you’re going to take Renteria, then there’s four. One has to think that Jose Reyes is also better, correct?

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]]> By: Sarah Green http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53225 Sarah Green Wed, 03 Oct 2007 13:00:36 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53225 gej, I meant defensively. Tulowitzki has a higher fielding percentage and range factor. Everett edges him out on zone rating. I assume your three better shortstops would be Renteria, Rollins, and Hanley Ramirez (isn't it odd, btw, that two of those are former Red Sox?). I can only say that the NL is clearly where the AL was a few years ago when Jeter, A-Rod, and Nomar were all at the position: a state of unsustainable wealth akin to the dot-com bubble. I can't hold it against Troy for coming up in such an economic climate! And Nick...I assume that was a Freudian slip on your part when you called Braun an "every day first baseman." I, personally, would like to see Braun at a defensively forgiving position such as first, but alas for the Brewers and for me, he plays the defensively crucial position of third base. And yeah, I know once he was called up he was their everyday guy. But he still missed almost two months of the season. For me, it comes down to this: Tulowitzki, in his first year, played like a veteran. Braun played like a rookie. Therefore, Tulowitzki gets the ROY. But I'm sure next year, Braun will have the last laugh when he goes to the All-Star Game. gej, I meant defensively. Tulowitzki has a higher fielding percentage and range factor. Everett edges him out on zone rating.

I assume your three better shortstops would be Renteria, Rollins, and Hanley Ramirez (isn’t it odd, btw, that two of those are former Red Sox?). I can only say that the NL is clearly where the AL was a few years ago when Jeter, A-Rod, and Nomar were all at the position: a state of unsustainable wealth akin to the dot-com bubble. I can’t hold it against Troy for coming up in such an economic climate!

And Nick…I assume that was a Freudian slip on your part when you called Braun an “every day first baseman.” I, personally, would like to see Braun at a defensively forgiving position such as first, but alas for the Brewers and for me, he plays the defensively crucial position of third base. And yeah, I know once he was called up he was their everyday guy. But he still missed almost two months of the season.

For me, it comes down to this: Tulowitzki, in his first year, played like a veteran. Braun played like a rookie. Therefore, Tulowitzki gets the ROY. But I’m sure next year, Braun will have the last laugh when he goes to the All-Star Game.

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]]> By: BeraH http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53223 BeraH Wed, 03 Oct 2007 06:55:29 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53223 Adam Everett was out several months with a broken leg. Braun was taken out in the late innings of every game I saw him in. He had great offense, but obviously his coach held his defensive liabilities against him if he actually removed him from games regularly. I really do like Braun but I can see how it's not a longshot that Tulowitski would get the ROY. Adam Everett was out several months with a broken leg.

Braun was taken out in the late innings of every game I saw him in. He had great offense, but obviously his coach held his defensive liabilities against him if he actually removed him from games regularly.

I really do like Braun but I can see how it’s not a longshot that Tulowitski would get the ROY.

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]]> By: gej http://umpbump.com/press/2007/10/02/cookies-for-rookies/comment-page-1/#comment-53220 gej Wed, 03 Oct 2007 04:45:26 +0000 http://umpbump.com/press/cookies-for-rookies/#comment-53220 The *best* shortstop in the league? Do you mean overall or just defensively, because I disagree with both. I think that Adam Everett is easily the best defensive shortstop in the national league and there are 3 shortstops in the national league east that are better than Tulowitski all around. The *best* shortstop in the league? Do you mean overall or just defensively, because I disagree with both.

I think that Adam Everett is easily the best defensive shortstop in the national league and there are 3 shortstops in the national league east that are better than Tulowitski all around.

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